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Post by municup14 on Feb 16, 2024 5:53:46 GMT -6
So I'm not a big stat guy but here are some interesting stats on Bobe and Bailey. Games played and started Bailey 25-1 Bobe. 25-11 Minutes Bailey averaging 18.9 Bobe. averaging 18.3 FGA Bailey 184 Bobe. 79 3pt shooting Bailey 19-49 Bobe. 19-65 And finally apple turnovers Bailey 34 Bobe. 9 As I said before the coaching staff sees these players every day in practice. And I also believe both players have strengths and weaknesses.
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Post by goacesgo on Feb 16, 2024 7:15:39 GMT -6
So I'm not a big stat guy but here are some interesting stats on Bobe and Bailey. Games played and started Bailey 25-1 Bobe. 25-11 Minutes Bailey averaging 18.9 Bobe. averaging 18.3 FGA Bailey 184 Bobe. 79 3pt shooting Bailey 19-49 Bobe. 19-65 And finally apple turnovers Bailey 34 Bobe. 9 As I said before the coaching staff sees these players every day in practice. And I also believe both players have strengths and weaknesses. So from this we can see that our coaches obviously value ball security, that’s why the coaching staff gets paid is to try and put all the pieces together at the right time. This is probably why Cuff comes in with Bailey, the turnovers would probably be much worse if not. I’m totally happy with the rotations, I think this year is the first time we have actually had opposing team’s substitute based on who we have in.
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Post by ATP on Feb 16, 2024 9:43:51 GMT -6
At the end of all this, what we assumed was a really deep rotation is now effectively 9 players. Splitting that up by positional value, I think maybe Ragland came up "one short" with his makeover of the roster. Even if that 10th guy was Kalle, he would not affect Bobe's position. Maybe Jackson was supposed to be "Bobe" and didn't get it done. But it points to how difficult it is to find a competitive roster in one year and part of another. Ragland is lucky Bobe is at least competent. The alternative to that would be an 8-man rotation and that's not deep enough. You'd start losing close games by the middle of the 2nd half instead of on flung-up prayers at the buzzer.
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Post by aradace on Feb 16, 2024 10:06:55 GMT -6
I agree with Starter comment. If Chuck leaves it will not because of Bobe playing time. The only thing I would like to say is that if Bailey is leaving let him do it as soon as the season is over with. So Coaches can look into the portal or Freshman to come in. Really would be interested to know what has kept Jackson and Day off the court. Day has to be better than Kallee, of he isn't we recruited two wrong kids and need to part ways with them. And am interested to see what the Brazil kid will bring next year. Go Aces keep playing hard.
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Post by justaacesfan on Feb 16, 2024 10:26:50 GMT -6
I can’t believe we here debating about who’s better Bailey or Bobe smh. We know who the better player and has the brighter future. Bailey was never gonna start at all. Once Wilson left that was over. That’s just how it goes in college basketball. Coaches play their guys and Bailey is not Rags guy. Look around the league all the other top freshmen are playing major mins. Coaches are double down on the future of their programs but we are not. Bailey a 4 ⭐️ recruit the highest in UE history 4 Time Freshmen of the week still plays less than 20mins a game, and now playing a walk on in front of him. Make that make sense? Anybody who know basketball knows what that means. Either he wants him gone or he’s preparing for him to leave.
Let’s talk numbers Who will have the best Per 40? Strawbridge Jr. 28.8 min 9.7ppg. 3.8rbs 2.4ast 1.8stl 1.6 TO 42.5 FG% 88/207 63.4 FT%. 45/71 34.4 3p%. 22/64
Thomas 25.4 ppg 7.7ppg 2.3reb 2.0 ast 0.8 stl 1.5 TO 41.3 % FG. 63/154 83.8 % FT 62/74 30.2 % 3P. 13/43
Cuff 21.9 min 7.8 ppg 4.2 reb 2.5 ast 0.8 stl 1.5 TO 51.3% FG. 78/152 73.3% FT 33/45 34.2 % 3P. 13/38
Bailey 18.9 min 9.2 ppg 2.7 rbs 0.9 ast 0.3 stl 1.4 TO 41.3% FG 76/184 81.7 % FT 58/71 38.8% 3P 19/49
Bobe 18.4 min 3.0ppg 1.1 Rebs 0.7 ast 0.4 stl 0.7 TO 30.4% FG 24/79 90.0% FT 9/10 29.2 % 3P 19/65
Haffner 16.1 min 4.0 ppg 1.1 Rebs 1.0 ast 0.5 stl 0.7 TO 35.3 % FG 41/116 33.3 % FT 2/6 28.4 % 3P
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Post by purpleaces on Feb 16, 2024 10:54:13 GMT -6
I can’t believe we here debating about who’s better Bailey or Bobe smh. We know who the better player and has the brighter future. Bailey was never gonna start at all. Once Wilson left that was over. That’s just how it goes in college basketball. Coaches play their guys and Bailey is not Rags guy. Look around the league all the other top freshmen are playing major mins. Coaches are double down on the future of their programs but we are not. Bailey a 4 ⭐️ recruit the highest in UE history 4 Time Freshmen of the week still plays less than 20mins a game, and now playing a walk on in front of him. Make that make sense? Anybody who know basketball knows what that means. Either he wants him gone or he’s preparing for him to leave. Let’s talk numbers Who will have the best Per 40? Strawbridge Jr. 28.8 min 9.7ppg. 3.8rbs 2.4ast 1.8stl 1.6 TO 42.5 FG% 88/207 63.4 FT%. 45/71 34.4 3p%. 22/64 Thomas 25.4 ppg 7.7ppg 2.3reb 2.0 ast 0.8 stl 1.5 TO 41.3 % FG. 63/154 83.8 % FT 62/74 30.2 % 3P. 13/43 Cuff 21.9 min 7.8 ppg 4.2 reb 2.5 ast 0.8 stl 1.5 TO 51.3% FG. 78/152 73.3% FT 33/45 34.2 % 3P. 13/38 Bailey 18.9 min 9.2 ppg 2.7 rbs 0.9 ast 0.3 stl 1.4 TO 41.3% FG 76/184 81.7 % FT 58/71 38.8% 3P 19/49 Bobe 18.4 min 3.0ppg 1.1 Rebs 0.7 ast 0.4 stl 0.7 TO 30.4% FG 24/79 90.0% FT 9/10 29.2 % 3P 19/65 Haffner 16.1 min 4.0 ppg 1.1 Rebs 1.0 ast 0.5 stl 0.7 TO 35.3 % FG 41/116 33.3 % FT 2/6 28.4 % 3P Or he is building him up into the player he thinks he can be. He knows a hell of a lot more than you and me.
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Post by ATP on Feb 16, 2024 10:55:21 GMT -6
If the conversation involves why some players are starters and some are not, once the subbing starts, it's the guys on the floor. Why isn't Cuff starting? May be the best player on the team at times. Or Hughes? Tall guy, lots of promise. The fascination over being a starter is so-1960s.
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Post by aceloverlarry on Feb 16, 2024 11:34:56 GMT -6
I agree with Starter comment. If Chuck leaves it will not because of Bobe playing time. The only thing I would like to say is that if Bailey is leaving let him do it as soon as the season is over with. So Coaches can look into the portal or Freshman to come in. Really would be interested to know what has kept Jackson and Day off the court. Day has to be better than Kallee, of he isn't we recruited two wrong kids and need to part ways with them. And am interested to see what the Brazil kid will bring next year. Go Aces keep playing hard. Jackson has shown promise when he plays in garbage time. It is a little confusing why he got subbed in early in the Bellarmine game and hasn’t seen the floor since, but they did not play well when he was in the rotation briefly at bellarmine. It’s a team sport, so I don’t think that’s necessarily his fault, but Bellarmine did go on a big run when he was in the lineup. Have you watched Day when he gets in at the end of games? He’s got a lot of developing to do still. I don’t think he’s close to being a better option than Kalle right now from what we’ve seen, but he’s got a lot of career left to work on his development. No shame in not seeing the court for either guy. They’re freshman and I think Braylon will be ready to see the court next year for sure. He’s definitely talented offensively. I’m assuming his defense is what’s keeping him out of the rotation currently.
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Post by austinace on Feb 16, 2024 11:55:40 GMT -6
Those numbers by municup were cherry picked as three-point shooting and turnovers are the only offensive categories that Gage is in the conversation with Chuck; and Chuck is actually statistically a better three-point shooter than Gage this year.
So offensively the only stat I know of in Gage’s favor is turnovers, and that is valid as the per 40 minute stats quoted show Chuck turning the ball over twice as much. 1.4 versus 0.7). Even Gage’s per 40 minute assist numbers are lower than Chuck. Chuck is obviously better at getting to the foul line, a better multi-dimensional offensive player with a higher ceiling, rebounds better, is quicker, etc.
With that said, I do trust the staff on this one (especially because of the progress the staff has made in such a short amount of time when this team is healthy).
So again this probably comes down to team chemistry. Gage is good enough to get in the rotation and get minutes, especially because of the intangibles that he brings to the team as a fifth-year senior and his defense, etc. And he appears to know the scouting report inside and out from what I hear. But yes, his ceiling is definitely limited for a D1 player.
But since Gage is good enough to get rotation minutes and players with offensive skills like Ben, Yacine and Kenny are already on the floor and starting and there is only one basketball on the floor; and Chuck brings energy off the bench; and he is still learning the game; and he did not do well in his only start because he can be foul-prone and out of control, I can definitely see that it makes sense to start Gage as a senior and see how the matchups and the game goes from there as far as minutes played.
If Chuck sticks around and continues to accept being coached, he will get his opportunities and his future is bright.
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Post by justaacesfan on Feb 16, 2024 12:22:53 GMT -6
Those numbers by municup were cherry picked as three-point shooting and turnovers are the only offensive categories that Gage is in the conversation with Chuck; and Chuck is actually statistically a better three-point shooter than Gage this year. So offensively the only stat I know of in Gage’s favor is turnovers, and that is valid as the per 40 minute stats quoted show Chuck turning the ball over twice as much. 1.4 versus 0.7). Even Gage’s per 40 minute assist numbers are lower than Chuck. Chuck is obviously better at getting to the foul line, a better multi-dimensional offensive player with a higher ceiling, rebounds better, is quicker, etc. With that said, I do trust the staff on this one (especially because of the progress the staff has made in such a short amount of time when this team is healthy). So again this probably comes down to team chemistry. Gage is good enough to get in the rotation and get minutes, especially because of the intangibles that he brings to the team as a fifth-year senior and his defense, etc. And he appears to know the scouting report inside and out from what I hear. But yes, his ceiling is definitely limited for a D1 player. But since Gage is good enough to get rotation minutes and players with offensive skills like Ben, Yacine and Kenny are already on the floor and starting and there is only one basketball on the floor; and Chuck brings energy off the bench; and he is still learning the game; and he did not do well in his only start because he can be foul-prone and out of control, I can definitely see that it makes sense to start Gage as a senior and see how the matchups and the game goes from there as far as minutes played. If Chuck sticks around and continues to accept being coached, he will get his opportunities and his future is bright.
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Post by paradeuce on Feb 16, 2024 12:33:42 GMT -6
If the conversation involves why some players are starters and some are not, once the subbing starts, it's the guys on the floor. Why isn't Cuff starting? May be the best player on the team at times. Or Hughes? Tall guy, lots of promise. The fascination over being a starter is so-1960s. So true, ATP. The thought resurrects the 6'3" GARRET STURTZ (sp?) @ Drake. How many yrs. were they near the top of the MVC because of the 6th man Sturtz? The dude was feared OFF the bench!
Btw, I note where ISU lost their 6'7" Kent due to "concussion protocol" during the Tues night loss to IL St. He may miss their next SIU game. They have nobody of productive value off their bench, and given their last 4 gm shooting %, the high seasonal MP's may be taking a toll.
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Post by municup14 on Feb 16, 2024 12:49:55 GMT -6
Those numbers by municup were cherry picked as three-point shooting and turnovers are the only offensive categories that Gage is in the conversation with Chuck; and Chuck is actually statistically a better three-point shooter than Gage this year. So offensively the only stat I know of in Gage’s favor is turnovers, and that is valid as the per 40 minute stats quoted show Chuck turning the ball over twice as much. 1.4 versus 0.7). Even Gage’s per 40 minute assist numbers are lower than Chuck. Chuck is obviously better at getting to the foul line, a better multi-dimensional offensive player with a higher ceiling, rebounds better, is quicker, etc. With that said, I do trust the staff on this one (especially because of the progress the staff has made in such a short amount of time when this team is healthy). So again this probably comes down to team chemistry. Gage is good enough to get in the rotation and get minutes, especially because of the intangibles that he brings to the team as a fifth-year senior and his defense, etc. And he appears to know the scouting report inside and out from what I hear. But yes, his ceiling is definitely limited for a D1 player. But since Gage is good enough to get rotation minutes and players with offensive skills like Ben, Yacine and Kenny are already on the floor and starting and there is only one basketball on the floor; and Chuck brings energy off the bench; and he is still learning the game; and he did not do well in his only start because he can be foul-prone and out of control, I can definitely see that it makes sense to start Gage as a senior and see how the matchups and the game goes from there as far as minutes played. If Chuck sticks around and continues to accept being coached, he will get his opportunities and his future is bright. Cherry picking my Ass,Bailey has played more minutes than Bobe.Maybe Bobe plays a more conservative game than Bailey because you have to admit it,Bailey does play aggressive but sometimes he plays out of control.
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Post by ATP on Feb 16, 2024 13:37:27 GMT -6
Those numbers by municup were cherry picked as three-point shooting and turnovers are the only offensive categories that Gage is in the conversation with Chuck; and Chuck is actually statistically a better three-point shooter than Gage this year. . Cherry picking my Ass,Bailey has played more minutes than Bobe.Maybe Bobe plays a more conservative game than Bailey because you have to admit it,Bailey does play aggressive but sometimes he plays out of control. Bailey and Bobe are as different as the Moon is to Saturn. Both of them are generally round. After that, they differ. You can slot them into the same solar system and one of them will eventually come back to Earth. If that doesn't make sense, neither does a debate about Bobe and Bailey.
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Post by austinace on Feb 16, 2024 13:48:40 GMT -6
Cherry picking my Ass,Bailey has played more minutes than Bobe.Maybe Bobe plays a more conservative game than Bailey because you have to admit it,Bailey does play aggressive but sometimes he plays out of control. Municup, please re-read my post. You picked only 3-point shooting and turnovers when making your case. I looked at the per 40 minute stats and covered most everything you are talking about…Obviously Gage plays more “conservatively” as he is limited in his skill set and athletic ability and obviously Chuck tends to play out of control.
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Post by municup14 on Feb 16, 2024 14:01:21 GMT -6
Municup, please re-read my post. You picked only 3-point shooting and turnovers when making your case. I looked at the per 40 minute stats and covered most everything you are talking about…Obviously Gage plays more “conservatively” as he is limited in his skill set and athletic ability and obviously Chuck tends to play out of control. Both players have strengths and weaknesses. Peace out and let's root on our Aces.
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