|
Post by aces1982 on Mar 13, 2020 15:05:43 GMT -6
82, GTFOH! Seriously. What is your agenda here? All you ever did on the old board is argue..until you got banned. Now, after your long hiatus (due to things looking up) you resurface with your same snarky attitude and argumentive BS. Myself and numerous others have clearly pointed out to you how the program was competitive with these very schools prior to the arrival of the clowns...Jennings, Stanley, Simmons. Now, you are nitpicking on terminology, which is pathetic. Regardless, the point remainns we have and can compete at this level. Marty used your theory in the non-con by piling wins up on lower level teams. It got is nowhere and the fans didn't show up. You seriously think that is the cure now? This was a rough season, and I greatly appreciated the comradre and respectful, intelligent posting on this board. I really hope the mods don't allow you to ruin that with your constant arguments. You are the one arguing and can’t carry on conversation without getting butt hurt. All I have done is presented facts to your opinions. And if you don’t want to take my facts as facts then what makes your opinion superior to mine or anyone else’s? I was never banned from previous board and never have been.
|
|
|
Post by aces1982 on Mar 13, 2020 15:12:24 GMT -6
82, GTFOH! Seriously. What is your agenda here? All you ever did on the old board is argue..until you got banned. Now, after your long hiatus (due to things looking up) you resurface with your same snarky attitude and argumentive BS. Myself and numerous others have clearly pointed out to you how the program was competitive with these very schools prior to the arrival of the clowns...Jennings, Stanley, Simmons. Now, you are nitpicking on terminology, which is pathetic. Regardless, the point remainns we have and can compete at this level. Marty used your theory in the non-con by piling wins up on lower level teams. It got is nowhere and the fans didn't show up. You seriously think that is the cure now? This was a rough season, and I greatly appreciated the comradre and respectful, intelligent posting on this board. I really hope the mods don't allow you to ruin that with your constant arguments. Have a grown up conversation. Show me where they were ever competitive in the MVC. Not with opinions but with the facts. Show me when that happened?? IMO, you and some others are giving excuses to the people in charge of why we haven’t been competitive. Those are your and others opinions. There are zero facts that back that up. I don’t see how you and others get so upset when people disagree with you?
|
|
|
Post by Atlanta Ace on Mar 13, 2020 16:57:45 GMT -6
In the meantime 82, the powers that be at UE seem to think we can compete in the MVC. They must think that getting the right people on board is where to start also. I see no indication that they would even consider a change in conferences right now. Facts or not, we are in the MVC. If you want to take this issue up with the President or Athletic director at UE, do it. Purplestrong started this thread to hear everyone's opinion on the subject. He has.
After more thought, I'll recommend to E-Villan that we lock or delete this thread. It has served it's purpose.
|
|
|
Post by E-Villan on Mar 13, 2020 17:09:37 GMT -6
I agree wholeheartedly with Atlanta that this thread probably just needs to go away. First, I am going to give Aces82 an opportunity to address a question he seems to keep ducking.
I find it amusing he will comb through mine and others posts, to cherry pick a phrase, which has nothing to do with the overall point of post, but can't seem to respond to pointed questions on his rather negative opinions. So again, let's try this.
Can you name one school that has dropped conference affiliations to the level you advocate, or even divisions, and found success?
Loyola, Butler and Creighton are all similar private schools who spent years at the bottom of their conferences, at points well below where we currently sit, and not only found the right people to turn it around, but actually found success in higher level conferences.
Back to his outrage at my term, whatever you want to call it, Arad won 5 National Championships against most of the very schools that are currently in the MVC, and Crews won more than he lost against them as well. Just because Marty couldn't doesn't mean you destroy the program over it.
|
|
|
Post by aces1982 on Mar 13, 2020 18:50:01 GMT -6
I agree wholeheartedly with Atlanta that this thread probably just needs to go away. First, I am going to give Aces82 an opportunity to address a question he seems to keep ducking. I find it amusing he will comb through mine and others posts, to cherry pick a phrase, which has nothing to do with the overall point of post, but can't seem to respond to pointed questions on his rather negative opinions. So again, let's try this. Can you name one school that has dropped conference affiliations to the level you advocate, or even divisions, and found success? Loyola, Butler and Creighton are all similar private schools who spent years at the bottom of their conferences, at points well below where we currently sit, and not only found the right people to turn it around, but actually found success in higher level conferences. Back to his outrage at my term, whatever you want to call it, Arad won 5 National Championships against most of the very schools that are currently in the MVC, and Crews won more than he lost against them as well. Just because Marty couldn't doesn't mean you destroy the program over it. Couple things 1) you didn’t say Arad years. You said we beat up on these schools while in the MCC. That simply isn’t true. 2) you trust the powers to be that says we should be in the MVC. These are the same powers to be everyone questions and says are the problem? 3) almost all conference realignment is due to football not basketball. The non football schools are usually affected because of the football conference changes. 4) you asked for one school....Mercer. Mercer is a non football school that left the ASun. Mercer was in the ASun and changed to Southern in 2014. The ASun was rated higher then the Southern in 2010-2013(warren Nolan website). The first year they switched to Southern(2014), they not only went to NCAA for the first time since 1985. They beat the 3 seed Duke. You may lock this thread. I keep giving facts. You guys keep giving opinions. You guys opinion is not any better then my opinion. It’s an opinion. Mine is only backed up with some facts not speculation.
|
|
|
Post by Atlanta Ace on Mar 13, 2020 19:21:42 GMT -6
Well, I started this thread, so by the authority vested in my by absolutely no one , I hereby move to put a bullet in this thread and put it out of it’s misery.🙈 I’ve been convinced we should stay put and make whatever personnel changes are needed to turn the ship around ! Now let’s go recruit some shooters! Go Aces You sure? LOL! Go Aces!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 14, 2020 8:21:51 GMT -6
I think this conversation is mostly about if you think the glass is full or not. Their are plenty of examples for me to see when universities have the right people in place, and the resources to be successful, positive change can happen. Period. I am a competitive individual but also realistic. Don't really understand the sense of pounding on a program, which we all know has been awful for 2 decades for reasons that have already been discussed. At this point, I guess it just comes to how you want to perceive and analyze it. My take: my glass if overflowing...I love the Aces and the fact they play in a great conference, and I see strong reasons why the Aces should be successful in the future. If certain folks now want to challenge this, go right ahead. I don't form my opinion's on just "hope". Whatever conclusions you make on your own is up to you.
|
|
|
Post by aces1982 on Mar 14, 2020 9:29:18 GMT -6
I think this conversation is mostly about if you think the glass is full or not. Their are plenty of examples for me to see when universities have the right people in place, and the resources to be successful, positive change can happen. Period. I am a competitive individual but also realistic. Don't really understand the sense of pounding on a program, which we all know has been awful for 2 decades for reasons that have already been discussed. At this point, I guess it just comes to how you want to perceive and analyze it. My take: my glass if overflowing...I love the Aces and the fact they play in a great conference, and I see strong reasons why the Aces should be successful in the future. If certain folks now want to challenge this, go right ahead. I don't form my opinion's on just "hope". Whatever conclusions you make on your own is up to you. Well stated.
|
|
|
Post by E-Villan on Mar 14, 2020 11:23:23 GMT -6
Mercer AD on the move to the SoCon: “They have been so good to us,” Cole said of the A-Sun. “It wasn’t anything that the A-Sun has done to us for us to make this move. There were just some attractive qualities about the Southern Conference. One being the football option. Two was a more geographic, compact region, and probably third, one thing that we really, really liked was the fact that a lot of schools are very similar in nature to us as far as their mission, their enrollment.”
UE in the OVC checks none of those boxes.
Mercers move to the SoCon was a very minor, if a drop at all in overall basketball affiliation. Certainly not the drastic drop 82 advocates by going from the MVC to the OVC.
Mercer last went to the NCAA as a member of the A-Sun, not SoCon, in 2014. So if this was indeed a drop in conference, it hasn't worked out for them in 6 seasons yet. Prior to that was 1985. They have a total of (1) D2 NCAA appearance, and (3) D1 appearances, 1981, 85 and 2014. I don't know what their attendance looks like, but their arena capacity is around 3500. Is this really the example we should follow?
|
|
|
Post by sycamorefan96 on Mar 16, 2020 15:02:03 GMT -6
We've discussed this a lot on Sycamore Pride (the ISU board). I'd say probably half of our fans want to see us move to the OVC. The reasons are similar. A lot of us are sick of watching us lose every year. The difference is we are dead last in MVC basketball budget and coaches' pay. A lot of us are also pro-OVC due to the fact that we think it would help save our football program. We simply do not have the money, resources, and facilities to compete with the Dakota schools on a consistent basis. The OVC also has 11 public schools and 75% of their membership also sponsors scholarship football which is a big plus for a program like ours.
Thing is the OVC is not going to take anyone from the MVC until Murray State is gone. Trading Murray State for Indiana State or Evansville would probably be a mistake at this point of time. Maybe ISU could get them to take us as a football-only member but I have my doubts.
|
|
|
Post by acepurple84 on Mar 16, 2020 16:50:54 GMT -6
We've discussed this a lot on Sycamore Pride (the ISU board). I'd say probably half of our fans want to see us move to the OVC. The reasons are similar. A lot of us are sick of watching us lose every year. The difference is we are dead last in MVC basketball budget and coaches' pay. A lot of us are also pro-OVC due to the fact that we think it would help save our football program. We simply do not have the money, resources, and facilities to compete with the Dakota schools on a consistent basis. The OVC also has 11 public schools and 75% of their membership also sponsors scholarship football which is a big plus for a program like ours. Thing is the OVC is not going to take anyone from the MVC until Murray State is gone. Trading Murray State for Indiana State or Evansville would probably be a mistake at this point of time. Maybe ISU could get them to take us as a football-only member but I have my doubts. I would hope you do not have to leave. UE and ISU have enjoy a long time rivalry. I hate to lose you. Along with SIU for the same reason. We used to enjoy the Butler games every year until they got their big heads. I guess beating them the two years they went to the final game was too much for them and they wuss'd out.
|
|
|
Post by E-Villan on Mar 16, 2020 18:19:57 GMT -6
First, put me in the camp that would want Indiana State to stay in the MVC. With that said, I can see where it might have some appeal, especially if they want to continue football. While our basketball budget is near the top of the MVC, ISU's is dead last, and by a considerable amount. I understand they have to fund football. Personally, I would want to drop it altogether, or at least go the Pioneer League route, and increase the basketball budget. If that can't be done, then it could make sense. There are several similar schools in the OVC to them, and the Eastern rivalry could be interesting, being less than an hour apart.
Without moving or cutting football, is there any chance to increase the budget? This is one of the biggest reasons I don't see how they can possibly do better than Greg Lansing. He has the least to work with in the Valley, and manages to be competitive most seasons.
|
|
|
Post by sycamorefan96 on Mar 17, 2020 5:24:26 GMT -6
I would much rather see us go to the OVC for all sports than join the Pioneer League for football.
We spend around 4M on football and only 2M on basketball. They need to just take 1M from the football budget and apply it towards basketball.
Don't expect anything to change soon at ISU though. We have a president and an AD that have both been pretty terrible so far. Lansing just went 18-12 and there have been no signs of extending him for another year. He only has 1 year left on his contract, but unfortunately it's probably going to be a lame duck season which will hurt our recruiting.
Outside of baseball, I don't even get excited for ISU athletics anymore. I follow us because I'm a diehard fan, but we're just a complete joke of a program most of the time. My expectations for football and basketball will remain low as long as we are in the MVC/FC.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2020 7:16:32 GMT -6
I have always enjoyed ISU basketball, their teams have always been competitive. Lansing, and other coaches before him have been vastly under rated. The rivalry between the Aces and Sycamores has always been great. However, because of football, I would understand why some of the ISU fans would desire the OVC.
Murray State has coveted the MVC for a long time. I would love to have them...despite having to further divide the NCAA revenue money. Because of the cut backs the state of Kentucky has made in education, I am not even sure if they could make the jump at this point, even if the MVC gave an invitation. Prior to that, the MVC had given them a serious look and I had thought they were going to receive one two years ago...obviously didn't happen. My guess is that league president's liked what they have, and wanted to put the onus on each school to improve themselves instead of adding a team. I would have loved for the Racers to have joined...would have added a lot of excitement to the league and make it stronger.
Anyway, back to my original point - I like ISU and would never want to lose them under any condition.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 17, 2020 8:28:17 GMT -6
Let's change the subject. NEW CONFERENCE!!!!! UE, ISU, Murray, Belmont, St Louis, SIU, Austin Peay (great Pep band) ……. WHO ELSE? NMC, The "New Madrid Conference"
|
|