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Post by ATP on Feb 27, 2024 17:14:59 GMT -6
You can dislike UE all you want, but the folks on Walnut Ave. have enough to do running a Div. I sports program and trying to compete. They're not out to sabotage your program. I should have said UE would never want USI in the MVC and UE would try to get 3 schools to vote no but E-Villan is correct it would not benefit the MVC if USI was in the MVC. For the tv markets the MVC should look at Saint Louis, Kansas City and IUPU-Indianapolis. I do not dislike or like UE. UE is just another school to me. What I do not like is the superior attitude that some UE fans and UE Administrators have towards USI. You should probably not get too worked up about attitude. It's not worth it. Really, it's not.
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Post by ATP on Feb 27, 2024 17:17:49 GMT -6
Isn't Valpo considered the Chi-town "market." (SMA)
Btw, they're talking on ISU board about high ticket sales for the Aces game Wed night. It's THESE atmosphere's which fuel the E-ville/ISU rivalry. I'm seeing an Aces upset...boy would that be a lasting scar in their bark.
Chicago likes to think of Valpo as part of its market and traditionally, it has been from electronic media standpoint. I don't think Valpo U considers itself in the Chicago market.
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Post by purpleaces on Feb 27, 2024 17:32:19 GMT -6
It's way too soon for USI to be joining the MVC. They're only in their 2nd season of transition into Div. I. But if the time comes that the MVC were to extend an invitation, how would UE stop it from happening? No one school can stop another from joining. All the league members have a vote. You can dislike UE all you want, but the folks on Walnut Ave. have enough to do running a Div. I sports program and trying to compete. They're not out to sabotage your program. I should have said UE would never want USI in the MVC and UE would try to get 3 schools to vote no but E-Villan is correct it would not benefit the MVC if USI was in the MVC. For the tv markets the MVC should look at Saint Louis, Kansas City and IUPU-Indianapolis. I do not dislike or like UE. UE is just another school to me. What I do not like is the superior attitude that some UE fans and UE Administrators have towards USI. The Valley is the 9th ranked Conference in the country. There is a huge difference between the Valley and the OVC. UE also has a tradition that USI will never have. It's not arrogance just facts. There is no way USI will ever be in the Valley for the simple fact they will not put 2 teams in the same market. It would make zero sense. Let USI get their feet under them and hopefully they will competitive in the OVC.
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Post by ATP on Feb 27, 2024 18:11:05 GMT -6
The Valley is the 9th ranked Conference in the country. There is a huge difference between the Valley and the OVC. UE also has a tradition that USI will never have. It's not arrogance just facts. There is no way USI will ever be in the Valley for the simple fact they will not put 2 teams in the same market. It would make zero sense. Let USI get their feet under them and hopefully they will competitive in the OVC. I can think of several reasons why USI won't likely ever be part of the MVC. All of that is based on what we know and what we think we will know in two, five, 10 or 20 years -- or in that other universe. How-EV-er, I won't agree completely that it's because of market. But I'd need to talk to people who study markets, who could say, yes ... what you say is correct or, no ... that's not the reason. If the MVC is ahead of the OVC, it's because the OVC is trending downward, and it's on real fast slope downward. In a couple of years, USI may dominate it in several sports.
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Post by harrison88 on Feb 27, 2024 18:21:02 GMT -6
I should have said UE would never want USI in the MVC and UE would try to get 3 schools to vote no but E-Villan is correct it would not benefit the MVC if USI was in the MVC. For the tv markets the MVC should look at Saint Louis, Kansas City and IUPU-Indianapolis. I do not dislike or like UE. UE is just another school to me. What I do not like is the superior attitude that some UE fans and UE Administrators have towards USI. The Valley is the 9th ranked Conference in the country. There is a huge difference between the Valley and the OVC. UE also has a tradition that USI will never have. It's not arrogance just facts. There is no way USI will ever be in the Valley for the simple fact they will not put 2 teams in the same market. It would make zero sense. Let USI get their feet under them and hopefully they will competitive in the OVC. Its not about tradition and its not about the MVC or the OVC both are going to be one bid leagues. Its about some UE fans having a superior attitude and some Administrators have towards USI.
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Post by ad1770 on Feb 27, 2024 18:39:25 GMT -6
The Valley is the 9th ranked Conference in the country. There is a huge difference between the Valley and the OVC. UE also has a tradition that USI will never have. It's not arrogance just facts. There is no way USI will ever be in the Valley for the simple fact they will not put 2 teams in the same market. It would make zero sense. Let USI get their feet under them and hopefully they will competitive in the OVC. Its not about tradition and its not about the MVC or the OVC both are going to be one bid leagues. Its about some UE fans having a superior attitude and some Administrators have towards USI. Can you name these administrators that have a “superior attitude” towards USI? I would love to know considering I have never heard a cross word from any admin about USI.
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Post by harrison88 on Feb 27, 2024 19:14:12 GMT -6
Its not about tradition and its not about the MVC or the OVC both are going to be one bid leagues. Its about some UE fans having a superior attitude and some Administrators have towards USI. Can you name these administrators that have a “superior attitude” towards USI? I would love to know considering I have never heard a cross word from any admin about USI. Do you work in the UE Administration? Lets start with Ziggy's comment about UE-USI men's basketball game. Ziggy said the fans wants it and it had to benefit both schools but then turned around and offered USI a one year contract with a payout. How would a one year contract with a payout of pennies on the dollar benefit USI when USI can sign a one year contract with a payout with Duke, Michigan State, Notre Dame and Missouri. Then Ziggy offered a 2 for 1 contract. Two games at the Ford Center and 1 game at the Screaming Eagles Arena. Again how is a 2 for 1 going to benefit USI? When I see USI and UE playing home and home games in all sports equally then I will know UE will treat USI as a equal.
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Post by ad1770 on Feb 27, 2024 19:36:22 GMT -6
Can you name these administrators that have a “superior attitude” towards USI? I would love to know considering I have never heard a cross word from any admin about USI. Do you work in the UE Administration? Let’s start with Ziggy's comment about UE-USI men's basketball game. Ziggy said the fans wants it and it had to benefit both schools but then turned around and offered USI a one year contract with a payout. How would a one year contract with a payout of pennies on the dollar benefit USI when USI can sign a one year contract with a payout with Duke, Michigan State, Notre Dame and Missouri. Then Ziggy offered a 2 for 1 contract. Two games at the Ford Center and 1 game at the Screaming Eagles Arena. Again how is a 2 for 1 going to benefit USI? When I see USI and UE playing home and home games in all sports equally then I will know UE will treat USI as a equal. Well, as far as I am concerned, I could care less if UE ever plays USI in basketball. Hell, most USI fans talk down on UE and dream of the day they can play a home and home with the likes of Murray St., Western KY, or any MAC and CUSA team they can name. Guess what. They won’t offer them a home and home either. So you can take the two for one, like you did with SIU, but don’t expect any school above the horizon league to give you the sweetheart deal that the trees gave you (in scheduling a double home and home). The world isn’t fair. USI doesn’t want a two for one from UE, but it is just fine from SIU, so, to quote you, what is the benefit for UE to schedule USI at all? Technically, USI is and will be a quad 4 game most years just because of the OVC, and it really doesn’t matter that they are road kill for a Michigan State, Notre Dame, or any other P-5 school you can schedule. Also, glad you listen to the podcast. Just wish you would have waited till Ziggy was done talking before you started screaming obscenities and drowning out anything else he was saying. You might have learned something.
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Post by harrison88 on Feb 27, 2024 20:04:43 GMT -6
Do you work in the UE Administration? Let’s start with Ziggy's comment about UE-USI men's basketball game. Ziggy said the fans wants it and it had to benefit both schools but then turned around and offered USI a one year contract with a payout. How would a one year contract with a payout of pennies on the dollar benefit USI when USI can sign a one year contract with a payout with Duke, Michigan State, Notre Dame and Missouri. Then Ziggy offered a 2 for 1 contract. Two games at the Ford Center and 1 game at the Screaming Eagles Arena. Again how is a 2 for 1 going to benefit USI? When I see USI and UE playing home and home games in all sports equally then I will know UE will treat USI as a equal. Well, as far as I am concerned, I could care less if UE ever plays USI in basketball. Hell, most USI fans talk down on UE and dream of the day they can play a home and home with the likes of Murray St., Western KY, or any MAC and CUSA team they can name. Guess what. They won’t offer them a home and home either. So you can take the two for one, like you did with SIU, but don’t expect any school above the horizon league to give you the sweetheart deal that the trees gave you (in scheduling a double home and home). The world isn’t fair. USI doesn’t want a two for one from UE, but it is just fine from SIU, so, to quote you, what is the benefit for UE to schedule USI at all? Technically, USI is and will be a quad 4 game most years just because of the OVC, and it really doesn’t matter that they are road kill for a Michigan State, Notre Dame, or any other P-5 school you can schedule. Also, glad you listen to the podcast. Just wish you would have waited till Ziggy was done talking before you started screaming obscenities and drowning out anything else he was saying. You might have learned something.
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Post by E-Villan on Feb 27, 2024 20:26:50 GMT -6
I don't think it is a case of Ziggy "looking down" on USI, rather a man simply keeping the best interest of his program in mind. At this point, that best interest is financial. A UE/USI game is a guaranteed big gate, especially early on. Other than IU, Purdue and UK, there is probably not another school he could schedule that will outdraw a UE/USI game. If Ziggy is willing to take the risk of losing to a transitioning program, then at least guarantee yourself the best financial return you can get from it. Selling half the tickets to play at USI just doesn't make sense when you can draw that many more downtown. The Ford Center holds 10K. UE is averaging about 4K. USI fans can fill a lot of those 6K seats and make it pretty neutral.
If Ziggy was simply scared of losing to USI, there would be no offer of a 2/1 or any game.
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Post by harrison88 on Feb 27, 2024 20:32:53 GMT -6
ad1770 I did not listen to Ziggy's podcast I listen to a two minute clip on twitter of Ziggy talking about a UE-USI game and I was not screaming a hollering in fact I was stunned. I am like he's joking right. As like you I could care less if UE and USI play in any sport its the casual fan who wants it not UE not USI fans. As for other USI I do not think they are putting down UE if I remember right they were responding to a UE fan claiming that UE would be USI "super bowl" and USI responding saying who they wish they could play. Hell doesn't UE fans wish they could play Butler and Xavier on a yearly bases? As for what does UE benefit from playing USI and USI play UE ticket sales dollar signs but it has to be on a equal bases. Offer USI a 10 year contract to start play in 2025-26 and play every year for the next 10 years 5 games at the Ford Center and 5 games at the Screaming Eagles Arena. As for USI signing a 2 for 1 for Southern Illinois you have to talk to USI on why the did that. The only thing I can think was that USI was a new school and needed games, From what I understand the OVC is going to a 20 conference game schedule and the OVC is looking to end the 2 for 1 deals. If that is true then most likely you will see less OVC teams playing MVC teams.
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Post by harrison88 on Feb 27, 2024 20:39:44 GMT -6
I don't think it is a case of Ziggy "looking down" on USI, rather a man simply keeping the best interest of his program in mind. At this point, that best interest is financial. A UE/USI game is a guaranteed big gate, especially early on. Other than IU, Purdue and UK, there is probably not another school he could schedule that will outdraw a UE/USI game. If Ziggy is willing to take the risk of losing to a transitioning program, then at least guarantee yourself the best financial return you can get from it. Selling half the tickets to play at USI just doesn't make sense when you can draw that many more downtown. The Ford Center holds 10K. UE is averaging about 4K. USI fans can fill a lot of those 6K seats and make it pretty neutral. If Ziggy was simply scared of losing to USI, there would be no offer of a 2/1 or any game. If you think I was implying Ziggy was scared of playing USI that was not my intention nor do I think Ziggy is afraid of scheduling USI. If USI and UE are going to schedule games in different sports I just want it to be equal on a home and home bases.
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Post by aces44 on Feb 27, 2024 20:46:14 GMT -6
A) the AD at UE’s job is not to make a deal “beneficial to USI”, so good for Ziggy, but he’s already offered too much imho B) no UE v USI game should ever be held anywhere but the Ford Center - USI can go get their heads kicked in around the country if they don’t like it C) USI should be happy that they play in a crappy league that they can dominate if they get their stuff together. Their path to the NCAA tournament is much easier than UE’s even if their team isn’t as good
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Post by harrison88 on Feb 27, 2024 20:53:37 GMT -6
A) the AD at UE’s job is not to make a deal “beneficial to USI”, so good for Ziggy, but he’s already offered too much imho B) no UE v USI game should ever be held anywhere but the Ford Center - USI can go get their heads kicked in around the country if they don’t like it C) USI should be happy that they play in a crappy league that they can dominate if they get their stuff together. Their path to the NCAA tournament is much easier than UE’s even if their team isn’t as good So how many bids are this "crappy" league in the NCAA D1 tournament going to get? And how many bids do you think the MVC is going to get in the NCAA D1 tournament? I think you just proved my point about how some UE fans have a superior complex towards USI
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Post by ATP on Feb 27, 2024 21:06:30 GMT -6
USI should always take the road game if they get the chance to play UE. Tradition-schmadition. If they put 10K in the F.C., you take a chance you can get the win. It is about the money. UE is playing USI in every other sport, and while some of us were a bit puzzled as to why they didn't get a BB game, I assume it's coming. That's just bogus to hang an opinion on UE being arrogant. They've played the Screams in the past and will play them in the future. Soon. There's no incentive to not play them. Either way, claiming fans have an attitude about USI is really a manufactured gripe. This is an Aces fan board. Of COURSE it's pro-Purple. There is a lot more to interscholastic competition than the number of bids a conference gets to a tournament that is clearly set up to exclude all but one token invitation anyhow. Finally, Ziggy came to UE to reorganize athletics at 1800 Lincoln. His job is specifically that. Expect him to make decisions that follow that job description.
Strange that a throwaway comment about "another universe" has flattened it out to resemble the one we most recognize -- pfffffffffffffffft ...
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