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Post by ncace on Jan 22, 2020 13:55:04 GMT -6
I am good with Lickliter. Multi-year may mean the remainder of this season, then 2 more. Meanwhile, perhaps Todd can find a top-notch, recruiting ASSOCIATE HEAD COACH, ala Graves, or maybe Ragland once the season is over. Meanwhile, Prez P has lessened the angst of the fan base and provided continuity to the players. This is a much better option, IMHO, than continuing down the road with Bennie.
Let's see how the players take to coach Lick, as he returns. I believe that he had established some credibility with them up until he left for health reasons, and i do believe that he has the best chance to retain our recruits, as well as our holdovers into next year. I also agree with another poster; DeAndre is the key to recruiting success. If coach Lick can keep him, he also keeps Samari.
Tonight's game should give us a good barometer, both on players reaction to coach coming back, as well as how he relates to assistant coaches and how coach "works" the game. Let's see the level of energy the guys bring tonight. Go Aces!!
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Post by acesfansince1990 on Jan 22, 2020 14:09:06 GMT -6
People have to remember that Lickliter was on the staff when they got Sam, Deandre, Artur, and Peace. He knows these guys. He has only been away for about 6 months.
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Post by kyace1 on Jan 22, 2020 14:10:47 GMT -6
Todd would have been there in May. This hire made it so that it's impossible to even make a call to a guy and try to make a better hire Amen. This guy gets it. The only reason not to wait until spring is because they want to try to salvage the current season. Which, fair enough, but not if it means sacrificing the ability to get the right guy for the long haul. We could have had the Coach of the Future in two months; now we have to wait two years. If You are only waiting two years… Isn’t the need for immediate cohesion of utmost importance. If you lose every player and have to do a complete rebuild, the pool of coaches who want to come for an underpaid, losing, mid-major dumpster fire of a program would not be deep. I am very encouraged by the amount of talent on our team. Have been very discouraged for the last year and a half by how that talent has been managed. I am hopeful that a seasoned coach can get more out of this team. And if he can hold onto most of the roster, UE might be able to have average/good seasons for the next two years. In my opinion, this would make the job opportunity at UE much more attractive. If all of the players bail after this season, it does not matter who the coach is... We are in for a long hard rebuild.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 14:34:11 GMT -6
This is really about a university being between a rock and a hard place. I guess just being angry at UE for hiring the replacement under these conditions seems a little unfair. There isn't much he can do into the end of February anyhow other than just keep the players from unraveling.
As far as next year goes, it's s bit early to be throwing Lickliter under the bus. All this has done so far is convince me that this is not a program ready to contend for a post-season berth. Maybe they get good enough to be in the conversation at Arch Madness. This is topsy-turvy mid-majors basketball. Lickliter knows the drill.
If they were a year away under McCarty's plan, we won't ever know anyway. If the recruits who were on the UE radar have changed their minds, then we just need to get different players.
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Post by evilleways on Jan 22, 2020 14:40:25 GMT -6
<abbr data-timestamp="1579723847000" class="o-timestamp time" title="Jan 22, 2020 15:10:47 GMT -5">Jan 22, 2020 15:10:47 GMT -5</abbr> kyace1 said: If You are only waiting two years… Isn’t the need for immediate cohesion of utmost importance. If you lose every player and have to do a complete rebuild, the pool of coaches who want to come for an underpaid, losing, mid-major dumpster fire of a program would not be deep. I am very encouraged by the amount of talent on our team. Have been very discouraged for the last year and a half by how that talent has been managed. I am hopeful that a seasoned coach can get more out of this team. And if he can hold onto most of the roster, UE might be able to have average/good seasons for the next two years. In my opinion, this would make the job opportunity at UE much more attractive. If all of the players bail after this season, it does not matter who the coach is... We are in for a long hard rebuild.
The nightmare scenario isn't the need for an immediate rebuild. The nightmare scenario is that we stagnate for the next two years, the community grows completely apathetic, and then we need to blow it up and rebuild at a time when the average attendance is less than half of what it is now. Which is what happened under Lickliter at Iowa.
I'm surprised that I'm the negative one on this because I'm usually Mr. Brightside. Hopefully the others on here are right and I end up being wrong.
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Post by kyace1 on Jan 22, 2020 14:51:12 GMT -6
<abbr data-timestamp="1579723847000" class="o-timestamp time" title="Jan 22, 2020 15:10:47 GMT -5">Jan 22, 2020 15:10:47 GMT -5</abbr> kyace1 said: If You are only waiting two years… Isn’t the need for immediate cohesion of utmost importance. If you lose every player and have to do a complete rebuild, the pool of coaches who want to come for an underpaid, losing, mid-major dumpster fire of a program would not be deep. I am very encouraged by the amount of talent on our team. Have been very discouraged for the last year and a half by how that talent has been managed. I am hopeful that a seasoned coach can get more out of this team. And if he can hold onto most of the roster, UE might be able to have average/good seasons for the next two years. In my opinion, this would make the job opportunity at UE much more attractive. If all of the players bail after this season, it does not matter who the coach is... We are in for a long hard rebuild.
The nightmare scenario isn't the need for an immediate rebuild. The nightmare scenario is that we stagnate for the next two years, the community grows completely apathetic, and then we need to blow it up and rebuild at a time when the average attendance is less than half of what it is now. Which is what happened under Lickliter at Iowa.
I'm surprised that I'm the negative one on this because I'm usually Mr. Brightside. Hopefully the others on here are right and I end up being wrong.
I hope you’re wrong too. I also hope that the difference between Lickliter at Butler and Lickliter at Iowa had to do with recruitment and/or competition. Maybe he just couldn’t recruit at a level that could compete with power 5. We are a mid major. I want to be a great mid major. I want to elevate beyond mid major. But right now we are mid major and he has had success at a mid major program that paved the way for them to become much more. I hope for the next couple of years he can pave a way forward for Evansville. Maybe it is blind hope. But I see reasons to believe it is more than that.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 15:13:27 GMT -6
Todd L was not going to be a fit at Iowa...I remember the day he was hired. Too much money to say no the Hawkeyes. Look at Dana Altman...couldn't do a thing with Nebraska. There are other cases just like that. Kevin Stalling, a very capable coach, absolutely bombed at Pittsburg. It's all about fit...that is what makes Todd L particularly a great choice for Evansville for reasons I have stated in an earlier post.
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Post by acesfansince1990 on Jan 22, 2020 15:21:45 GMT -6
Hey, lets change the subject and talk about the women's program for a second. Any words on that one. Nope. Lets keep it on the other post.
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Post by castle69 on Jan 22, 2020 15:25:41 GMT -6
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 15:34:25 GMT -6
I don't see Lickliter as the bridge from the Disaster Swamp to the Golden Gravy Bowl. That's going to be somebody else, maybe an assistant who takes over in a couple of years. If the fan base thinks this hire is about turning the corner toward a solid program, it's more about keeping the ship headed in the right direction. This is a known guy who has experience and success, and was available. He probably came at the right price, which isn't nothing. My hunch is that he's well-liked on campus, which also is a good thing. As far as the administration thinking about basketball success, they are also looking at what was becoming image failure -- the image the university reflects in a metoo generation that isn't going away.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2020 15:45:54 GMT -6
Altman coached at Kansas State, not Nebraska. My mistake
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Post by indymoon on Jan 22, 2020 15:46:13 GMT -6
This was a decision made to try to salvage the current season. (Honestly, it was probably more like Mark Spencer and President P were tired of everyone asking about the coaching situation anytime they went to the grocery store.) They had their eye on 2-5 weeks in the future, rather than 2-5 years. It was a safe hire made out of fear, not out of opportunity. I have no quarrel with Coach Lick. He's a man of high character. I don't think he's the right man for the job, but I hope he proves me wrong. I have a major quarrel with the Powers That Be at UE and how this decision came about. Hiring a full-time replacement in January because "everybody already knows this guy" is something that high schools do, not big-time college programs. As regards keeping the current players happy, you're damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't. The players should not be dictating to the AD. We saw that happen at IU after Knight was fired; the players wanted Mike Davis; they went with Mike Davis, and the program slowly radiated its brand away. But to play devil's advocate, a decade later after Sampson was fired from IU, they did the opposite thing by hiring Dakich rather than the guy the players wanted. They didn't retain Dakich full-time, the remaining players either quit or were kicked off the team, and they were stuck with a down-to-the-foundation rebuild. What I wish we'd done is what WISCONSIN did (the same season that Knight-to-Davis happened at IU, funnily enough.) Dick Bennett quit midseason; the interim guy finished out the year; he wasn't retained. Then the AD went out and hired Bo Ryan, who had local ties and played a similar style, and he ended up becoming the best coach in school history. IU made a lot of mistakes while replacing Knight by first listening to the players, then listening to the fans, then allowing the President to dictate the next coach (Sampson). But after Sampson was fired, the players left because of Dakich and that's indicative of their lack of discipline and dedication to the program. IU was much better off without those players. Your description of Bo Ryan could apply to Lickliter in this case - "local ties and played a similar style". Todd was on the bench last year.
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Post by ytele on Jan 22, 2020 15:51:24 GMT -6
Altman coached at Kansas State, not Nebraska. My mistake He was also the Big 8 coach of the year in 1993
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Post by 83Ace on Jan 22, 2020 16:03:16 GMT -6
Todd L was not going to be a fit at Iowa...I remember the day he was hired. Too much money to say no the Hawkeyes. Look at Dana Altman...couldn't do a thing with Nebraska. There are other cases just like that. Kevin Stalling, a very capable coach, absolutely bombed at Pittsburg. It's all about fit...that is what makes Todd L particularly a great choice for Evansville for reasons I have stated in an earlier post. Coach TL made me think of a couple of people who did not fare so well at P5s but left for mid-majors and thrived. Dana Altman left K-State (where he was generally underwheming) to go to Creighton, where he obviously did well. Greg McDermott was a success at UNI and hired by Iowa State. The program went downhill and he left ISU for Creighton, where he has had a great run there. (Apparently, getting a good mid-major coach who did not do so well as a P5 coach seems to be the Creighton model.)
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Post by 83Ace on Jan 22, 2020 16:06:51 GMT -6
Altman coached at Kansas State, not Nebraska. My mistake He was also the Big 8 coach of the year in 1993 He was Big 8 coach of the year with a 7-7 record. Never had a winning record in conference. But he did beat Kansas a couple of times, which meant he could have stayed at K-State longer if he wanted. Everybody was surprised when he left for Creighton - it seemed like a big step down - but I think he knew it was a better fit.
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