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Post by evilleways on Jan 23, 2020 22:49:57 GMT -6
You can't do a nationwide search for a coach hoping to get one who isn't already under contract. It's against the rules. All you will find is an unemployed coach. You can start such a search in March or April, but you can't in January. There are rules against calling coaches who are under contract, and none of them would agree to the interview anyhow. It's conflict of interest on a major scale. Even if the coach initiates the call, it's tampering. You can start the search in January. You can call up your contacts and find out who might be interested. You can get your list pared down to three or four names. You can go watch those guys in person. When March comes around, you can get permission to interview assistant coaches. The head coaches are happy to give that permission because they want their guys to get head coaching gigs. Last year Mercer hired Greg Gary off Purdue's staff before Purdue's season was over.
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Post by Aces&Eights on Jan 24, 2020 8:09:10 GMT -6
Great speech Coach L gave the team
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 8:29:13 GMT -6
You can't do a nationwide search for a coach hoping to get one who isn't already under contract. It's against the rules. All you will find is an unemployed coach. You can start such a search in March or April, but you can't in January. There are rules against calling coaches who are under contract, and none of them would agree to the interview anyhow. It's conflict of interest on a major scale. Even if the coach initiates the call, it's tampering. You can start the search in January. You can call up your contacts and find out who might be interested. You can get your list pared down to three or four names. You can go watch those guys in person. When March comes around, you can get permission to interview assistant coaches. The head coaches are happy to give that permission because they want their guys to get head coaching gigs. Last year Mercer hired Greg Gary off Purdue's staff before Purdue's season was over. Yes, if you believe an assistant coach from somewhere -- which you probably already know about just because programs keep lists of people -- is right for this university. In this case, it's a matter of whether the fans/players/admin think Lickliter is better than an assistant somewhere who might be willing to take the job. To put a cap on my point here, the complaints are that UE "should have" done a nationwide search. Maybe they were hasty giving TL this contract but I'd wager they weren't going to get a guy with his portfolio without giving him the contract. He doesn't need to spend 2 months as an interim. "Hire me or get somebody else." The "somebody else" is exactly what you describe. UE is not going to recover easily from this. I don't have strong opinions on this hire other than trying to see it from UE's point of view, which is not necessarily about basketball but overall university image. Sexual harassment is not one of those victimless crimes that gets laughed off by the boys on the sports desk. These accusations and allegations are ruining companies now. This is a serious issue for a university, and giving the impression that they aren't dealing with it is a monumental mistake. Keeping Bennie on the bench would be a daily reminder that he's subbing for Walt. Bennie doesn't benefit from that. I don't think he was doing much to help the team, but that's maybe on the players, not him. We are seeing a bad mix of athletes. Hiring Lickliter right away gives the impression that the administration got control of the situation, dealt with it fairly and made a firm decision based on what it wanted to do to correct the problem. Did they do that? Dunno ... but letting this hang around through the NCAA tournament would not have improved the situation. If I thought this was all a gaslighting event, I'd agree that they could have done something else. Either way, the university wipes the egg off its face with this hire but the basketball program doesn't get a seat at the table now. I hear that President P is a big sports guy. I also know that university presidents are big boosters of big boosters. Who weighed in on this hire? We won't know that. What we see is what we got.
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Post by ytele on Jan 24, 2020 9:27:03 GMT -6
This seems like a safe, comfortable hire that was made in panic and as a result of a dire situation. Sure, Lickliter will improve the culture and provide some stability during a tumultuous time after McCarty embarrassed the program. However, bigger picture, I'm not sure how a 64 year old coach who flamed out at Iowa, was bad at Marian, and recently stepped down this offseason due to health issues is really going to help this program improve. The program should've conducted a national head coaching search. If after that, Lickliter is the guy, fine, but why limit your options? (and I think Graves would've been the better long-term coaching prospect of the two). I take offense in your reference to Lickliter’s age of 64. There are many top level coaches out there who are in their 60s and older. We have a President who is 73 and the top Democrats running are in their upper 70s. You need to get over your age discrimination. As for TL’s health issues, it was documented that he fell off a ladder at his home and suffered a severe concussion. He said he didn’t feel he could do justice to the team and other coaches unless he was fully recovered from the injury. He now states that he is, so that should be the end of this story. At Iowa TL assumed someone else’s recruits. Maybe they weren’t right for his coaching style or maybe it was something else, but for an $8 million multi-year contract apparently the Iowa Administration thought he was right for the job. His record was not that good but was he given the chance to succeed. The Marian job shouldn’t even be discussed here. Although I seem to remember reading somewhere that under TL Marian won the most conference games ever or something like that. As far as a national coaching search, UE just completed one of those less than two years ago. They had a pretty good idea of the type of candidates UE could attract and afford. Absence of TL being available that would have been the right choice but even at that there is still no guarantee of hiring a successful candidate. Todd Lickliter’s record still Butler should speak for itself. Before he was Butler’s HC he assisted under some very accomplished head coaches. We must not forget he was the one who hired Brad Stevens. Let’s not degrade Coach Lickliter’s coaching ability until he has had a chance to perform. After all his first game as coach was less than 24 hours after he was hired for a team that was underperforming and missing its best player. Age absolutely plays into it. Those guys you listed in their 70s are the top of the top of the top in terms of coaches, have built and sustained top 5-10 programs for decades. Won national titles. They aren't getting "one last chance to lead a program" in their mid 60s at a small mid major that has been mostly borderline terrible for 20 to 25 years. At 64 years old coming off of a major head injury there rightfully could/should(?) be concerns about his ability to handle the stress of the job. Young kids that have head injuries like that often struggle the rest of their lives, and they have younger "healthier" brains/bodies to recover with. I won't get political but I struggle to vote for a president - either side - that is 70 plus years old. The stress and extreme attention to detail that job requires is something that I'd feel better about having someone slightly younger, late 40s through early 60s, do. He inherited someone elses recruits at Butler - a program that had been to 4 NCAA tournaments in 5 years. Once those kids were gone we fell under .500 and loaded up on 1 or 2 year rental transfer guys to get his S16 his final year there. So if he doesn't have to count Iowa because they weren't his kids, his first 3 years at Butler also don't count. That Iowa program he took over had been to 2 NCAA tournaments in 3 years and ranked in the AP top 15 many many times. They were a 3 seed in the NCAA tournament. His time are Marian is worth talking about. They were in the NAIA S16 a year before he got there. He had 3 straight seasons at under .500. 2 years after he was gone and they were an NAIA Elite 8 and Final Four team in back to back seasons.
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Post by ACES FAN on Jan 24, 2020 9:34:41 GMT -6
I wonder if he will retain the current assistants or will he look to hire his own guys to fit his style of play and recruiters.
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Post by COUTEAU on Jan 24, 2020 9:56:54 GMT -6
I thought that the team(s) with the back court Butler had of Graves & Green were pretty damn good. I think his last two/three years @ Butler were "his" guys
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Post by mybigpurplebrain on Jan 24, 2020 9:59:00 GMT -6
He should look for he best he can get as assistants. Maybe a mix of who’s here and new.
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Post by COUTEAU on Jan 24, 2020 10:07:42 GMT -6
I think and had posted it on PAF.com before. Adam Wing, would make a good assistant/bench coach. He bleeds ACES ORANGE...PURPLE and I think would enjoy to be back in the fold.
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Post by ytele on Jan 24, 2020 10:09:51 GMT -6
I thought that the team(s) with the back court Butler had of Graves & Green were pretty damn good. I think his last two/three years @ Butler were "his" guys His last 3 years were 33-28 leading into his final year of 29-7 That final year if you look at the roster was super transfer heavy because he had done no recruiting/developing HS players. 3 of the top 5 players that year - Green, Campbell and Petko - were all 1 or 2 year rental transfers that were gone by the year after. Were they "his guys" in that he brought them in as a transfer? Sure. He didn't recruit them out of high school or do the majority of their development. Maybe he will bring in almost exclusivity transfers for his 2 year tenure and hope to get them around the sitting out.
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Post by aceschamps6571 on Jan 24, 2020 10:25:29 GMT -6
So, if we go by the comments of the "critics," and I didn't say "haters," then any success Todd Lickliter may have here, it will be with "someone else's players." There are also instances when a coach has left for another job, and instead of leaving the so called "cupboard" bare, he has left behind a talented roster and the new coach didn't do so well. TL takes over at Butler and leads them further than they had gone, instead of a worse season, and he supposedly won because of some other coach's players. Maybe after taking over those guys, he helped them to get better. Evidently, that doesn't count if he wasn't the head coach when they arrived. Mr. Lickliter didn't have to come here at this time and take over this team, and subject himself to criticism, but he cares enough about the school and program to come back to Evansville and try to get things turned around and moving forward. How about we give this man a chance to develop and coach this team? From the sound of things, they need some direction instead of a buddy. It won't happen overnight, but in my personal opinion, not speaking for anyone else, I believe we have our best coach since Jim Crews.
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Post by ytele on Jan 24, 2020 10:33:24 GMT -6
So, if we go by the comments of the "critics," and I didn't say "haters," then any success Todd Lickliter may have here, it will be with "someone else's players." There are also instances when a coach has left for another job, and instead of leaving the so called "cupboard" bare, he has left behind a talented roster and the new coach didn't do so well. TL takes over at Butler and leads them further than they had gone, instead of a worse season, and he supposedly won because of some other coach's players. Maybe after taking over those guys, he helped them to get better. Evidently, that doesn't count if he wasn't the head coach when they arrived. Mr. Lickliter didn't have to come here at this time and take over this team, and subject himself to criticism, but he cares enough about the school and program to come back to Evansville and try to get things turned around and moving forward. How about we give this man a chance to develop and coach this team? From the sound of things, they need some direction instead of a buddy. It won't happen overnight, but in my personal opinion, not speaking for anyone else, I believe we have our best coach since Jim Crews. I could go with that with is butler teams if he wasn't under .500 within 2 years of the guys he inherited leaving. His third year at Iowa was a 10 win season. I hope he succeeds. Hope I'm wrong. His track record anywhere except Butler is very bad, at best.
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Post by acepurple84 on Jan 24, 2020 10:35:43 GMT -6
So, if we go by the comments of the "critics," and I didn't say "haters," then any success Todd Lickliter may have here, it will be with "someone else's players." There are also instances when a coach has left for another job, and instead of leaving the so called "cupboard" bare, he has left behind a talented roster and the new coach didn't do so well. TL takes over at Butler and leads them further than they had gone, instead of a worse season, and he supposedly won because of some other coach's players. Maybe after taking over those guys, he helped them to get better. Evidently, that doesn't count if he wasn't the head coach when they arrived. Mr. Lickliter didn't have to come here at this time and take over this team, and subject himself to criticism, but he cares enough about the school and program to come back to Evansville and try to get things turned around and moving forward. How about we give this man a chance to develop and coach this team? From the sound of things, they need some direction instead of a buddy. It won't happen overnight, but in my personal opinion, not speaking for anyone else, I believe we have our best coach since Jim Crews. Forget the haters. If we don't hire a guy with a resume of success like a Rick Pitino or better (not with the baggage of course) they will poo poo anyone. We have a good coach now. He has to have time to get his way of playing instilled into the players now. Walter played a NBA style with very little defense and all offense in hopes you out score your opponent. Unfortunately the guys quit hitting their shots. Maybe because the other teams figured it out a let them shot the 3. Let TL develop the players first. He is a good teacher and I hope the players stay and learn.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2020 10:39:05 GMT -6
If it means anything at all I tweeted Trey Hall and Kahalil Shaheed and expressed my hope they will still come to UE. Both of them "liked" my message to them. Hard for me to believe they would do that if they had made up their mind to go somewhere else. Those two coming on board with the return Andre would be a good boost.
The rest of this year will be Coach TL getting the team stabilized, and implementing and tweaking the offense and defense. I have do illusions of seeing a great turn around the rest of the year, though I am certain within a couple of weeks we will see some improvement.
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Post by stennisrm72 on Jan 24, 2020 11:07:45 GMT -6
If it means anything at all I tweeted Trey Hall and Kahalil Shaheed and expressed my hope they will still come to UE. Both of them "liked" my message to them. Hard for me to believe they would do that if they had made up their mind to go somewhere else. Those two coming on board with the return Andre would be a good boost. The rest of this year will be Coach TL getting the team stabilized, and implementing and tweaking the offense and defense. I have do illusions of seeing a great turn around the rest of the year, though I am certain within a couple of weeks we will see some improvement. Khalil has already tweeted that he is reopening recruitment.
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Post by bballjunkie on Jan 24, 2020 11:10:57 GMT -6
If Lickliter inherited good players at Butler, then he helped recruit those guys since he was the top assistant for 2 years before taking over as head coach, right? So, in his first season, the Freshmen, Sophs, and Juniors would’ve likely been influenced to go there by Lickliter.
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