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Post by austinace on Mar 8, 2024 14:16:02 GMT -6
Jevin's thoughts:
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Post by ad1770 on Mar 8, 2024 14:37:44 GMT -6
I get what Jevin is saying, but two things. One, this is a tough business, and things like this can happen in a hurry. Two, this was not because of a single elimination tourney game. This was the culmination of the season. Yes, they were picked to finish 9th, and finished 6th, but, consider the bad decisions he made this season, the bad losses, especially when you are playing for the four seed in your own barn, and get blown out. That loss may have been the loss that sealed his fate. Question now turns to this. With Mo. St. just losing, will Ford get the run now to have the chance to go after the coach they want.
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Post by aces44 on Mar 8, 2024 15:09:46 GMT -6
Doubt it had much to do with losing to UIC (didn’t help, but). Likely had much more to do with losing players that are having great seasons in the B10 l(particularly when he didn’t win big w them last year) and not having a recruit signed for next year. Those are both problems.
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Post by ATP on Mar 8, 2024 18:26:52 GMT -6
I'd agree that the UIC loss didn't just suddenly invoke a "Let's call a meeting this morning and fire the coach."
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Post by E-Villan on Mar 9, 2024 10:08:49 GMT -6
It seemed a little rash until I learned he had zero recruits for next year, and was entering his final year. When you are on the downside of a contract without much success, recruiting becomes increasingly difficult. I'm not sure it's fair, but it's the game today. I would suspect Prohm is going to find it tough sledding this year as well.
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Post by purpleorange on Mar 9, 2024 11:29:55 GMT -6
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Post by ATP on Mar 9, 2024 14:28:24 GMT -6
Just wondering, if UE had gone 42-23 over the last two seasons, would the fans be asking for Ragland's head?
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Post by aceloverlarry on Mar 9, 2024 15:56:56 GMT -6
Just wondering, if UE had gone 42-23 over the last two seasons, would the fans be asking for Ragland's head? There’s people asking for his head after losses because Chuck Bailey or Cam Haffner didn’t play enough in their opinion. So, assuming it’s not just the same record but the same roster and circumstances, I think a lot of people on this board would’ve been calling for Raglands head as they watched Lance Jones and Domask excel in the Big Ten. I think SIU made the right move imo. It could backfire horribly on them like when we moved on from Marty, but Mullins had more than enough time & talent to prove he was the guy, and he couldn’t ever get it done. Exceeding expectations this year doesn’t matter when expectations were so low solely because of his poor recruiting. He got in two really good players and then had them for 4 years and was never able to build on them with other good players.
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Post by ad1770 on Mar 9, 2024 17:28:41 GMT -6
Just wondering, if UE had gone 42-23 over the last two seasons, would the fans be asking for Ragland's head? There’s people asking for his head after losses because Chuck Bailey or Cam Haffner didn’t play enough in their opinion. So, assuming it’s not just the same record but the same roster and circumstances, I think a lot of people on this board would’ve been calling for Raglands head as they watched Lance Jones and Domask excel in the Big Ten. I think SIU made the right move imo. It could backfire horribly on them like when we moved on from Marty, but Mullins had more than enough time & talent to prove he was the guy, and he couldn’t ever get it done. Exceeding expectations this year doesn’t matter when expectations were so low solely because of his poor recruiting. He got in two really good players and then had them for 4 years and was never able to build on them with other good players. Actually, I believe Domask and Jones were Hinson’s recruits, and stayed on after they let him go, but I could be wrong.
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Post by hedlyvanhalen on Mar 9, 2024 18:23:14 GMT -6
There’s people asking for his head after losses because Chuck Bailey or Cam Haffner didn’t play enough in their opinion. So, assuming it’s not just the same record but the same roster and circumstances, I think a lot of people on this board would’ve been calling for Raglands head as they watched Lance Jones and Domask excel in the Big Ten. I think SIU made the right move imo. It could backfire horribly on them like when we moved on from Marty, but Mullins had more than enough time & talent to prove he was the guy, and he couldn’t ever get it done. Exceeding expectations this year doesn’t matter when expectations were so low solely because of his poor recruiting. He got in two really good players and then had them for 4 years and was never able to build on them with other good players. Actually, I believe Domask and Jones were Hinson’s recruits, and stayed on after they let him go, but I could be wrong. Domask was a Mullins guy. Decommited from NKU and signed in Spring 2019. Big get that late. Wisconsin Mr Basketball. I don’t know about Jones.
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Post by ATP on Mar 9, 2024 18:33:14 GMT -6
Just wondering, if UE had gone 42-23 over the last two seasons, would the fans be asking for Ragland's head? There’s people asking for his head after losses because Chuck Bailey or Cam Haffner didn’t play enough in their opinion. So, assuming it’s not just the same record but the same roster and circumstances, I think a lot of people on this board would’ve been calling for Raglands head as they watched Lance Jones and Domask excel in the Big Ten. I think SIU made the right move imo. It could backfire horribly on them like when we moved on from Marty, but Mullins had more than enough time & talent to prove he was the guy, and he couldn’t ever get it done. Exceeding expectations this year doesn’t matter when expectations were so low solely because of his poor recruiting. He got in two really good players and then had them for 4 years and was never able to build on them with other good players. I think this is a fairly incisive point about expectations. How good does a mid-major need to be over how long a period before expectations suddenly jump up a rung? If the nature of the Valley and leagues like it is to have complete roster overhauls every year now, the odds of getting a home-run roster grow increasingly long. If you luck out and get a chemically cohesive team, it's probably going to be pillaged by the P4. Does an administration factor that in? Do they care? If they give Ragland 3 years and in the 4th year, he's got a group of juco transfers because it's all he could get in June ... is that a coffin nail? What does the public expect? We ain't gonna beat the SEC or the B1G and if we're lucky, they will even schedule us in the future.
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Post by 65pointgame on Mar 9, 2024 18:36:21 GMT -6
Guys that go from the MVC to bigger schools often do pretty well. Top to bottom, the transition defense is much better in the MVC than the P5s.
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Post by aceloverlarry on Mar 9, 2024 19:23:13 GMT -6
There’s people asking for his head after losses because Chuck Bailey or Cam Haffner didn’t play enough in their opinion. So, assuming it’s not just the same record but the same roster and circumstances, I think a lot of people on this board would’ve been calling for Raglands head as they watched Lance Jones and Domask excel in the Big Ten. I think SIU made the right move imo. It could backfire horribly on them like when we moved on from Marty, but Mullins had more than enough time & talent to prove he was the guy, and he couldn’t ever get it done. Exceeding expectations this year doesn’t matter when expectations were so low solely because of his poor recruiting. He got in two really good players and then had them for 4 years and was never able to build on them with other good players. I think this is a fairly incisive point about expectations. How good does a mid-major need to be over how long a period before expectations suddenly jump up a rung? If the nature of the Valley and leagues like it is to have complete roster overhauls every year now, the odds of getting a home-run roster grow increasingly long. If you luck out and get a chemically cohesive team, it's probably going to be pillaged by the P4. Does an administration factor that in? Do they care? If they give Ragland 3 years and in the 4th year, he's got a group of juco transfers because it's all he could get in June ... is that a coffin nail? What does the public expect? We ain't gonna beat the SEC or the B1G and if we're lucky, they will even schedule us in the future. Raglands going to get a longer leash than most simply because of how low the bar was when he started. I’m of the opinion that he should get 5-6 years no matter what unless it gets Lickliter ugly at some point, which it won’t. For other programs though, you expect your coach to perform at a middle of the pack level at a minimum. Once they’ve consistently performed at that level, you would expect them to be able to keep building and take the next step to be occasionally competing for championships. Mullins kind of took the next step in his final year with Domask & Jones, but not really. He finished third and never seriously competed with the top of the league. The SIU AD did a podcast interview explaining the decision and said he was like 5-28 against top 3 teams in the league in his 5 year tenure. Only won two games in Arch Madness. Never made it to Sunday or won multiple games in one arch madness. Just a lot of mediocrity. He was always good against the average/bad MVC teams, but couldn’t get over the hump against the good ones. As far as transfer portal & rebuilds go, I think it’s part of todays game and something fans need to accept, but it also means you need a coach that is built for that and ready to reload too. Mullins wasn’t that. It would’ve been a lot easier for the SIU AD & Fanbase to be sold on an extension if he was recruiting at a high level still. Drake lost a ton of talent last year too, but they had portal and Highschool talent ready to replace what they lost. Mullins recruiting was quickly trending downwards. He did nothing in the portal last offseason and had no recruits this year. Without the hope of talent coming in, it’s a lot harder to sell a fan base on continuing the tenure of an average coach. I respect SIU for pulling the plug before it got really ugly next year, which I think it would’ve gotten.
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Post by austinace on Mar 10, 2024 1:16:09 GMT -6
Just wondering, if UE had gone 42-23 over the last two seasons, would the fans be asking for Ragland's head? Obviously “No” as Ragland inherited a totally different situation. (Some fans obviously will always call for the coach to be fired.)
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Post by municup14 on Mar 10, 2024 6:51:54 GMT -6
I hope we go 21-10 next year that's just another step in the right direction.
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